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 Post subject: Streaming Services
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2020 3:08 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 06, 2009 8:15 pm
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Location: Inverness, Scotland
The chart below shows how much (little) is made by an artist from streaming services. This in some way shows why concert tickets can be so expensive now.

J.O'B.


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 Post subject: Re: Streaming Services
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2020 4:01 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2010 7:13 pm
Posts: 412
I will always want to buy physical product. Something to cherish.


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 Post subject: Re: Streaming Services
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2020 2:30 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2009 9:58 pm
Posts: 924
It is amazing how the music business has been transformed/upended by streaming and smart phones. CDs and vinyl hold on as a "legacy" technology for a very distinctive fan base but they play little role in the overall economics of the business. Sigh.

Given the production costs that went into BF's recent "RAH '74" cd and vinyl I wonder whether any "profit" resulted from its release. It certainly seems unlikely that "streaming" would have generated much income based upon JO'B's chart.

Sigh...
DCJ


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 Post subject: Re: Streaming Services
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2020 2:41 pm 
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What about new up and coming musicians who by the time they get to the point of releasing something, they will have:-

Spent countless hours honing their craft.
They will have spent a lot of money on instruments, recording etc.
And a lot of people forget that while they are doing this in the hope they become a professional musician, they have dedicated their time to their music and not been studying medicine or civil engineering etc at uni.
They will not have been training as an apprentice joiner or plumber etc and earning a few bob as they do it.

At the end of all that they hope their music will be streamed several million times for them to earn a modest living and pay for the time, effort and equipment they have used up until that point.


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 Post subject: Re: Streaming Services
PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 12:05 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:40 am
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Location: Merseyside
The technology is marvelous and, it seems, revered by many musicians but whilst it's a fairly extreme example it's not unique to music - just look at the so called 'gig economy'. From a UK perspective, I also think it taps into the 'something for nothing' mentality that pervades so many aspects of life here. Just about wherever you look, we're a nation that knows the price of everything and the value of nothing. As such, don't expect anything to change any time soon.


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 Post subject: Re: Streaming Services
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 2:28 am 
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Location: New York City
I opt for physical product (vinyl, cds, even cassette, along with dvd and blu-ray) every time. The only time I will download if it is the only available option.


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 Post subject: Re: Streaming Services
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 10:17 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2009 11:39 am
Posts: 38
I guess it is just the inevitable march of technology but I think there are swings and roundabouts.

The most popular stream of Roxy Music on Spotify is MTT which has been streamed 76million times and from the table above that would generate £30,400 which if Spotify is roughly half the market you could double that figure. Although that is not what would have been historically earned from record sales it does give a recurring income from a body of work that won’t have sold much recently so I can see some benefit to a mature artist with a large back catalogue. Digital streaming can also make it easier for a new artist to get published although it doesn’t get you promotion and exposure. I guess the other point is that it’s definitely preferable to file sharing where the artist gets nothing.

I think the bit I miss the most from the LP days are treasuring the gatefold sleeves and artwork, plus the theatre of holding the disc, wiping the dust off and lowering the needle in the groove (to quote a phrase). On the flip side I can have access to pretty well every record made in the car (apart from Bete Noire and Mamourna......!!)


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 Post subject: Re: Streaming Services
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 11:17 am 
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Joined: Wed May 06, 2009 8:15 pm
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Location: Inverness, Scotland
Vinny wrote:
On the flip side I can have access to pretty well every record made in the car


I find this also has a negative affect because no one can listen to every record in the word and from what I see and hear about a large amount of Streaming Service users is that they 'cherry pick' from albums and mostly listen to the hits. The quote above about More Than This is an example of that.

When we invested in albums one album at a time we made sure we got our money's worth and listened to every track over and over and sometimes found that the less accessible songs became our favourites and developed a taste for and realisation that there is more to music than catchy hit singles.

To give an example of a real experience..... on New Years Eve 2019 I was playing with my band at a party in local hotel. We play the usual stuff that you get from function bands. During the break I played a play list off my tablet through the PA as background music. I had a folder with MPs of hit singles that I made from my CDs.

A woman around 30 years old and her husband asked me if I could play Neil Diamond Sweet Caroline. I replied "sorry it's not on there", she replied pointing at my tablet "yes it is, that's Spotify isn't it?" I explained it was from my own CDs. She in shock says "I can't believe you don't have Spotify"
I replied " you have just given me an example of why I don't like streaming, you have almost every song in the world to choose from and you chose the most worn out, over played, cheesiest song heard at functions like this."

She wasn't amused.

J.O'B.


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 Post subject: Re: Streaming Services
PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 12:55 am 
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Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 7:23 pm
Posts: 1311
Hipsters,
A great analysis by J.O’B followed up by some really interesting points.
Windswept lui-meme has long been of the opinion that streaming has lead to the banalisation of music.
Everything is available little is appreciated or revered.
UKRichard sums it up when he says “Wherever you look we are a nation that knows the price of everything and the value of nothing”.
Although, as Vinny points out, there are swings and roundabouts and it is better for the artist than file sharing, the real ultimate looser is the music itself, which appears to be increasingly completely lost in translation.
Very few listen multiple times to the full album. That age old methodology of listening that allowed us to fully appreciate and understand the music and its nuances.
As a consequence, even high quality music becomes disposable.
Two classic cases in point would be the relatively recent works of Paulo Nutini and Michael Kiwanuka. Will their works be listened to in 40 years time? Probably not yet many who have listened intently to their albums put their music up there with the classics of the ‘60s / ‘70s.
Even artists like Elbow and I Am Kloot appear to be on the wain.
Old successful bands are lucky. They have old successful fans who have been groomed to appreciate albums and have the money to buy concert tickets.
It seems that it’s the great artists of this century who suffer the most albeit the most recent quality offerings from legends like Dylan and Paul Weller have failed to cut through.
Sadly, as well as streaming, W2 also sees another potential blot on the horizon.
Many think that globalisation has left us very vulnerable to pandemics and that the current debacle will be the first of many (not for nothing has the issue been added to the purview of MI6). In this scenario, both artists and fans may have already developed or be developing a different attitude to mass gatherings and international travel.
Who knows what the new normal will really be ?
Maybe Nick Cave’s magnificent ‘Idiot Prayer’ project will be the way of the future ?
Nous verrons ce que nous verrons.
Salutations,
Windswept.


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 Post subject: Re: Streaming Services
PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:30 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2009 11:39 am
Posts: 38
I guess the other point is that along with technology, society has changed enormously. Back in the day music was really important and usually front and centre of a young person’s life (it was either listen to records in your room or watch 3 channels on TV with mum and dad). These days there is so much more in the mix with Netflix, YouTube, Tic Toc, Social media etc that for my kids, although they enjoy music, there is definitely not the anticipation of a new release or the joy of sneaking a transistor radio to school for the chart run down.

But again there are benefits, I can now communicate with Roxy Music aficionados on the other side of the world and I can give Brian Eno’s latest ambient release a spin whereas I probably wouldn’t have back in the day.

All in all I guess I am now closer to part 3 of ‘If There Is Something’ than the start of the season, however as I do possess the song on vinyl, tape, cd, and the dvd of Flashbacks of a Fool plus access to Spotify and YouTube, I guess I’ll be OK.


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