I believe that Roxy and Bryan's 'manifesto' was carved in stone within a year of the first album being released.

The Jazz Age 40 years later is BF re-making and re-modeling his own songs in a jazz style, nothing new to him here.

In between Roxy's second and third album BF did a jazz standard and drew attention to it by making a promo video (for a non single) and making it the title track to a solo album. The single of that track had BF re-recording an old Roxy song as a b-side and he continued to do that over the next 3 years re-making and re-modeling his own songs so The Jazz Age concept was hinted at then. It seems BF's work is only respected in some quarters pre 1977 but he did then what he is doing now really.

If BF's career was drawn on a graph with genre/time on the x & y colums then the line is not a straight one. When studied closely it goes all over the place with various different styles at different periods. You can never predict his next move, something Bowie is famed for. (I love Bowie and his work is number 2 for me)

I have said many times that my favourite era are the first 4 albums but I don't think those albums are flawless either. I don't draw a line in when Ferry was good and when he wasn't. The early period has some not so goog stuff too, and the later period has some great moments, granted less than the early period but there are still gems on every album.

J.O'B.

Yes, that is all good stuff John, but I still think the guys were wrong to release the last 3 albums under the Roxy Music banner. It was the wrong vehicle for the type of output that they went on to produce and flew in the face of the established brand; surely a breach of the Trades Description Act

Another band name, perhaps with a nod in the direction of Roxy so that people could pick up on the connection but which signalled that, although the line up was pretty much the same, the band was going to explore a completely different musical landscape would have been more appropriate e.g. Joy Division / New Order. OK, in addition to the change in musical direction there was a tragic reason behind that one, but you get the idea?

PS - is anybody really convinced by the Joy Division / New Order boys claim that they were oblivious to the Nazi connotations of their band names? Bryan would have been rightly slaughtered if he had done anything like that. The media seem to target some people (and Bryan is definitely on their hit list) while others are given a free ride.

Nope.

Great bands...and I mean really great....but...
And it was Sumner behind much of the imagery too, including the Hitler Jugend style graphics http://thep5.blogspot.de/2009/06/joy-di ... iving.html

I will always be a Roxy person - like many others I prefer the first four albums although I have to say Avalon is up there with the best.

For me F&B is the weakest, then Side Two of Manifesto and then Siren.

Ferry's stuff has its good and great moments scattered throughout his albums - Taxi (bar that famous thing that I can't remember of the top of my head) is a particular fave - but the two bodies of work can't be compared.

Ferry's has always been compromised by his control freakery whereas with Roxy there were other and better musicians to contribute to the Roxy sound, all of whom had a stake in the band.

Roxy Music is one of this country's greatest bands but is, as others have said a complete missed opportunity.

I am sorry to hark back to the who NEW ROXY ALBUM/DYLANESQUE/OLYMPIA/FYP TOUR fiasco, but that was the worst case of mis-management ever.

Neither the band nor Ferry could have made the most out of that - it was the most stupid period in the band's history ever. Too many sons involved probably.

I think its sad really

Agreed.
In management speak this was truly an episode of atrocious "expectations management"

Mes Amis,
Surely the reality of the debate is that Roxy and the self titled work are two sides to the same coin and that Roxy should just be viewed as a pseudonym for BF?
Doubtless this assertion will have devout "Roxyologists" tearing up their feather boas in a peak.
I say this because although the projects moved in tandem up until '75, the truth is that they morphed into one after "Siren".
Prior to that, Roxy was primarily a vehicle to plough an art rock furrow whilst the self titled albums were an outlet for his eclectic taste and experimentation with other types of music.
In my not so humble opinion (IMNSHO) it is the variety and the consistency of his work together with his phenomenal taste that broadened what was, prior to his emergence, a fairly tribal environment, that is the true magic.
It's worth remembering that between '65 & '75, popular music and the associated fashions were very tribal. For a Mod to profess to like Eddie Cochran or Elvis was a difficult thing and as somebody who used to ride a Triumph in his suit and Parka, I new the limit of the exercise!
Along came "Roxy" who changed all of that. It was cool to have an eclectic taste and we could dress well and be spared the ignominy of having to slip into one of Bowie's "Onesies".
Understandably,"Roxyologists" will always have their preferred part of such a diverse career but for me the past and the future are clear — he will continue to do what he wants, how he wants and when he wants and I'll love it!
In fact, IMNSHO, this thread should be re-titled "Roxy Music by Bryan Ferry" because that's what it was.
Regards,
Windswept

Windswept, you are an indefatigable Dr. Pangloss when it comes to BF. Quaffing down the Kool-Aid and always hoping for yet more of whatever brew BF decides to proffer for public consumption.

BF is an essential component of Roxy. But so are PM and AM. And it is the synergy among the three (along with TGPT for much of the band's career) that led to their greatest tracks and accomplishments. It is a shared legacy, and the notion that BF might have to "share" something lies at the heart of his ambivalence in committing to Roxy and his desire to completely control and define his musical persona and presence.

In many ways it's a miracle that Roxy survived the Sturm und Drang that accompanied Eno's (forced) departure from the band at BF's insistence. Roxy's career is replete with much missed opportunity, but there was/is much to rejoice in, celebrate. and enjoy. Whoops, there I go again sipping on the Roxy Kool-Aid...

We're nearing cross-party unananimity! Or are we.
Why then, was the like's of "Another Time, Another Place", just an of the cuff example, included on a solo venture when, it has, for me, Roxy Music stamped all over it, and the likes of "Dance Away" appearing on a Roxy Music album when it is a "Bryan Ferry" solo album song, really. There are numerous other examples, "I Thought" being, at the minute, the last great Roxy Music track, to appear on a Bryan Ferry album.
There are umpteen examples as well, on the B.F. solo front, where all the band members are there, bar one, or two. Is that deliberately to avoid it being "Roxy Music", and the £implication's (typo) thereof?
I take great comfort in the knowledge that I am not alone in the "mis-managed" department. I don't know that Roxy could ever have hit the dizzy heights of Bowie on a commercial basis, but they were/are undoubtedly a sleeping giant. That aspect of the venture has ripped my knitting, no end. Maybe the re-emergance of D.B. on the new release front will raise Ferry's lovely big eyebrow's, if even a little, Significant, also, IMHO, that Andy and Phill are doing a wee thing together. I would not ever rule out another Roxy "something".
All said and done, if anyone had said to me in 1973, when I first bought "Stranded", that we would still be discussing the output of Ferry/Roxy 40 year down the line, I would have given them a queer look. I think we all would have.

I, for one, am grateful for what we've had, and for what we are about to receive. I count myself lucky.

absof***inglutely.

and, TGPT.
And i'm a big, big BF fan, loving the vast share of his output, under whichever banner. No matter how much I love Nile Rodgers (and i really do) and other notables who work with BF, the BF, AM, PM, TGPT combo is quite special whenever it happens.

Good thread, by the way.

also, thanks to windswept for "IMNSHO". i'm going to use that one

Ardent Roxyologists,
I would like to publicly acknowledge that Sadie's boyfriend knocks my argument out of the park by evoking ATAP as a clear Roxy track but hey, if you wrote something as brilliant as this, wouldn't you save it for your own second solo album?
I do however challenge DJC's notion that "Make me a deal.." referenced a commercial contract (although I do love his obsession with Ferry's wonga). Where I come from that expression had much more fun connotations but I can well understand why one would like to posthumously explain it away in such a manner.
Finally, although the original line-up was undoubtably brilliant, IMNSHO, there greatest ever outing was the 2001 fandango when they were supplemented by the great Mr.Good and other assorted Ferryistas albeit, if they'd followed Avondale's advice, by then they'd have rebranded as "The Ritz".
Roxyologists will doubtless live on hoping for that next album whilst the rest of us are down the new Cotton Club.
Happy Easter and Regards,
Windswept.